Filed under: Linen Fabric
Question:
[[Probably part of the reason of my utter dislike of the chore is that my time and *insisted* that they were ironed and starched to perfection before they were put away in the wardrobe, and then *insisted* that they needed to be ironed again when they came back out. ]] After having read this story, I have two things to say. 1) I’m VERY glad he’s an EX. 2) You’d have been within your rights, had you inserted that iron into either the start point or the end point of his digestive tract. But take heart… if he continues behaving the way he did in the past, someone may bestow that treatment on him yet. (He’s gotta sleep SOMEtime. <eg) Shame on him. Donna
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Tell Persia to not fear, her dear Weebs was in the other room, and went running *to* the clatter to see what had happened. He stopped short of the kitchen when the three culprits exploded out through the door all puffed up. were moving to fast for me to see their faces – all I could see were three rear ends and three *very* puffy stripey-tails LOL LOL! Oh, I miss having kittens around. <getting broody again
I could send you notsoIBKFergus if you like 
That hooliketten has absolutely no shame or dignity wahtsoever,and is *obsessed* with my dishwashing sponges and one of Cary’s socks. Bizarre creature. Yowie
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The best use for an ironing board is to use it outside as a potting bench.The top is usually mesh, so excess potting mix falls through, and as the thing is adjustable, it can be set at a comfortable height. Just the thing for gardeners ! Marie from OZ
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is this "ironing board" of which you speak? 
When ‘ironing’ or ‘pressing’ clothes to remove wrinkles, most of the US American folk use an ironing board in conjunction with the ‘iron’ or perhaps ‘flatiron’, though that is an archaic term here. Yowie has a "thing" about liberation from ironing. Hehehee.
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[[What is this "ironing board" of which you speak? Yowie]] It’s a cat-attracting device which felines appear to regard as a plaything, a bed (see: Misty, RB), a punching bag (see: Captain) and/or a high-diving platform.
OR a pedestal for artistic poses. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Unfortunately, it’s not normally stable enough to maintain balance when a cat makes an especially vigorous leap up or down. This can result in a resounding crash of the ironing board, and possibly the garment and iron upon it, as everything falls to the floor. We humans keep hoping that at least ONE kitty who’s precipitated, or witnessed, this sort of mishap will send a communique to the Mothership, stating that ironing boards are best left alone by felines of all sizes and ages. But unfortunately, they never seem to get the word out, meaning that most cats must learn this lesson independently. Therefore, we feline-owned humans are destined to experience the occasional crash of unattended ironing boards to the floor. It’s our lot in life, and we must resign ourselves to it. ;o) Donna and the ironing-board attacking committee known as Captain and Stanley
Theresa Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
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to say about Re: Cats & Ironing Boards do NOT Mix : My ironing board hangs from the bedroom closet door. I just flip it down and it hangs there off the floor ready to be used. Since Persia isn’t a "jumper" she doesn’t even notice it. I recommend this type of board for anyone with limited storage space.
My apartment includes one that folds into a little niche in the wall (with door). — "The universe is quite robust in design and appears to be doing just fine on its own, incompetent support staff notwithstanding. " – the Dennis formerly known as (evil), MCFL
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On 2005-02-28, Magic Mood Jeep
Question:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop Both of which (keys and Swiss Army Knife) are two small to generate a return in L band, but those wonderful steel tubes every which way, would probably make wonderful dipoles. Which carbon RAM compound do you use in the paint ? I know not of this charred sheep’s pizzle to which you refer….. Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff It will depend on whether or not it is a doppler radar, and if so, how the range boxes have been set up, but I doubt she is slow enough.. Also there is the small matter of propulsion source. I haven’t seen a internal combustion engine yet that doesn’t have a pretty good radar signature.
I read in Phillip Will’s book "On being a bird" about experiments he was involved in during WWII to see if they could build a radar invisible aircraft. They were worried the Germans could invade with gliders which would be invisible to radar. They employed a modified glider (hence no engine) and fitted wooden pushrods and did other things to reduce radar signature, but to no avail. Even with the primitive equipment of the day, they could still spot him. On one of these excursions, his glide path back to the land fell below the level of the cliffs. He thought he was going to have to swim home, but found a strong updraft in front of the cliffs and was able to use it to get onto dry land. The scientists responsible for the project hadn’t seen him turn and run along the cliff face, and they all sprinted over to the cliff top to peer over and search for the wreckage below, much to Will’s amusement, who was by this time a thousand feet above them… Coop
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Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff Probably some truth in that. Doing helicopter survey ops around KLIA, clearances were conditional on flying faster than 70 knots, due to the radar software suppressing the return at low speeds. cheers, Paul Saccani Perth West Australia
browsing in a bookshop at something dramatic and SAS related I came across an account of an accidental russian discovery that an antonov an2 flying at less than 58 knots, despite being full of combat ready troops, was excluded as background by doppler radar that opposing forces were using. they even considered a full scale attack at 55knots but thought that it couldnt possibly be that easy. Stealth Pilot
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff Probably some truth in that. Doing helicopter survey ops around KLIA, clearances were conditional on flying faster than 70 knots, due to the radar software suppressing the return at low speeds. cheers, Paul Saccani Perth West Australia browsing in a bookshop at something dramatic and SAS related I came across an account of an accidental russian discovery that an antonov an2 flying at less than 58 knots, despite being full of combat ready troops, was excluded as background by doppler radar that opposing forces were using. they even considered a full scale attack at 55knots but thought that it couldnt possibly be that easy. Stealth Pilot
All doppler MTI radars have "blind speeds" which are functions of the operating frequency, hence wavelength, and the PRF (pulse repetition frequency) and the target’s radial velocity. These speeds are where the target moves 0, or a half, or 1 or 1.5 etc wavelengths between consecutive pulses. This results in the reflected signal being shifted precisely 360 degrees in phase, or multiples thereof, between pulses, thus not being detected. In this case, it appears that the first blind speed was 55 knots. If they wanted to be real sneaky, they could have charged in at a radial speed to the opposing radar of 110 knots, or 165 knots if the pilot was prepared to exceed Vne 162 knots (according to http://home.hiwaay.net/~jlwebs/an2welcome.html). Alternatively, since stall is 40 knots and best glide speed is 65 knots, they can glide in engine off at 55 knots easy, that way they are steep and quiet, stealthy, just what SAS types would want. You have to be sure you get the radial line of sight speed bang on of course, so you would have to know where the radar was exactly, compensate for winds, and fly your "track" every so precisely, or you would likely get a SAM up your bum.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop Both of which (keys and Swiss Army Knife) are two small to generate a return in L band, but those wonderful steel tubes every which way, would probably make wonderful dipoles. Which carbon RAM compound do you use in the paint ? I know not of this charred sheep’s pizzle to which you refer….. Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff It will depend on whether or not it is a doppler radar, and if so, how the range boxes have been set up, but I doubt she is slow enough.. Also there is the small matter of propulsion source. I haven’t seen a internal combustion engine yet that doesn’t have a pretty good radar signature. I read in Phillip Will’s book "On being a bird" about experiments he was involved in during WWII to see if they could build a radar invisible aircraft. They were worried the Germans could invade with gliders which would be invisible to radar. They employed a modified glider (hence no engine) and fitted wooden pushrods and did other things to reduce radar signature, but to no avail. Even with the primitive equipment of the day, they could still spot him. On one of these excursions, his glide path back to the land fell below the level of the cliffs. He thought he was going to have to swim home, but found a strong updraft in front of the cliffs and was able to use it to get onto dry land. The scientists responsible for the project hadn’t seen him turn and run along the cliff face, and they all sprinted over to the cliff top to peer over and search for the wreckage below, much to Will’s amusement, who was by this time a thousand feet above them…
It is a little more complicated than that. Chain Home, and most early Radars relied upon complex interactions betweens the radar signal and the airframe because often the airframe had dimensions on the same order of magnitude as the radar signals used to detect them. however when Radar went Microwave, the wavelengths became much shorter than the airfame dimensions, and the the actual orientation, or size of parts of the airframe became much less important. For example the dimension on a submarine periscope are such that the Radars in use at the outset of WWII would never see them. The periscope was very small relative to the wavelengths used in early radar. (2 meter wavelength) However by the end of the war, with Microwave radar, the periscope had been large relative to the wavelenght (10cm or so), and periscopes could be seen on radar at a distance of several miles.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff Probably some truth in that. Doing helicopter survey ops around KLIA, clearances were conditional on flying faster than 70 knots, due to the radar software suppressing the return at low speeds. cheers, Paul Saccani Perth West Australia browsing in a bookshop at something dramatic and SAS related I came across an account of an accidental russian discovery that an antonov an2 flying at less than 58 knots, despite being full of combat ready troops, was excluded as background by doppler radar that opposing forces were using. they even considered a full scale attack at 55knots but thought that it couldnt possibly be that easy.
As I said, it is question of where you set up the range boxes, if the lowest range box only goes down 60kt, anything below that will get tossed. Range boxes are basically audio frequency filters that split off the doppler shifted radar return based upon how much it has been shfited. Each range box will cover range of speeds. So what this suggests is the lowest range box started at about 60kt, so return below 60kt was simply ignored.
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And it just proves That if God had meant metal aeroplanes to fly he would have made steel trees!
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – just curious as to how good the fabric that covers aircraft is. are there any limitations etc, any plus or minus points LIfe used to be a factor with linen fabrics especially if parked outside. Modern fabrics last longer (twenty years or more) if well cared for, which includes keeping them shielded from U/V light by ensuring the paintwork is maintained and hangaring when not in use. Repairs are easy to the fanric itself, also access to underlying structures is straightforward (just cut a hole and glue a patch on afterwards). Major risk is hailstorms which can wreck fabric pretty quickly but big ones can wreck metal skinned aircraft too, and the fabric ones are easier to repair. Fire is another consideration- most of the dopes are pretty flammable, so a fire in a fabric skinned aircraft can leave you with a charred skeleton very quickly and usually they don’t fly very well after that…. Some spectators are unaware that the Pitts Special is fabric covered, so the covering can manage a reasonably high speed and G-loading provided the stitching is close enough. Finally, the skills of fabric covering, repair and maintenance are not too hard to learn so you can help your LAME and your girlfriend won’t feel as out of place with a needle in her hand as she would with a rivet gun…. Coop
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Probably not the altitude, just not fast enough to outrun a cow. ;) If you must know, it was tied down! And that was nearly forty years ago. Only kidding, JD. cheers, Paul Saccani Perth West Australia
No he wasn’t. He does this all the time, ‘cos he’s jealous he hasn’t got one. Pay no attention…… Coop
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Probably not the altitude, just not fast enough to outrun a cow. ;) If you must know, it was tied down! And that was nearly forty years ago. Only kidding, JD. No he wasn’t. He does this all the time, ‘cos he’s jealous he hasn’t got one. Pay no attention…… I was going to say "Only kidding, JD, at least you’ve got one, I haven’t", but then I saw "nearly forty years ago", and thought that maybe he doesn’t. I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? cheers, Paul Saccani Perth West Australia
No, I don’t own a plane at present – and the Auster was traded on a C180 in 1969 when I moved to PNG – and I sold it after returning to Australia. JD
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I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G
And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop
Both of which (keys and Swiss Army Knife) are two small to generate a return in L band, but those wonderful steel tubes every which way, would probably make wonderful dipoles. Which carbon RAM compound do you use in the paint ?
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop Both of which (keys and Swiss Army Knife) are two small to generate a return in L band, but those wonderful steel tubes every which way, would probably make wonderful dipoles. Which carbon RAM compound do you use in the paint ?
opps – "too small"
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. I had in mind the rather meticulous and thorough restoration by Stealth of Tailwind fame. cheers, Paul Saccani Perth West Australia
had a hiccup for a few years while I rose to the heights. now resident in my new workshop and will see renewed activity this semester break. experimenting with Qld Hoop Pine at present …by building a turbulent. how many aeroplanes is too many? Stealth Pilot
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop Both of which (keys and Swiss Army Knife) are two small to generate a return in L band, but those wonderful steel tubes every which way, would probably make wonderful dipoles. Which carbon RAM compound do you use in the paint ?
I know not of this charred sheep’s pizzle to which you refer….. Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff Coop
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop Both of which (keys and Swiss Army Knife) are two small to generate a return in L band, but those wonderful steel tubes every which way, would probably make wonderful dipoles. Which carbon RAM compound do you use in the paint ? I know not of this charred sheep’s pizzle to which you refer….. Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff Coop
RAM = radar absorptive material, usually a carbon impregnated rubber honeycomb sheet designed to act as a kind of resistor to intercept radar energy and absorb it, dissipate it as heat, before the metal bits can reflect / re-radiate it. There was also a paint developed along the same lines, but with limited utility apparently. MTI = moving target indicator, which was used way back, and was processed video out of the radar receiver, where you could set a speed threshold to reduce clutter, but it was also of limited use. well, the piston ones anyway ……. surely, though, alas, perhaps not
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On a historical note: Bullets pass straight through fabric but do nasty things to metal. I think this was one of the key differences between the Spitfire and Hurricane in WW2. Shot up Hurricanes were much easier to repair and get back running again. Cheers, Richard.
Another reason why Hurricanes were easier to get back into service was that the u/c was mounted on a centre section, unlike the Spitfires, which was on the wing. In the event of a damaged wing, the Hurricane wing could be replaced without having to support the aircraft. It is said that the civil repair crews could do the job in about an hour. Vic —
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On a historical note: Bullets pass straight through fabric but do nasty things to metal. I think this was one of the key differences between the Spitfire and Hurricane in WW2. Shot up Hurricanes were much easier to repair and get back running again. Cheers, Richard. Not just bullets – cow horns with my Auster. JD
Just a suggestion – fly more than 6 feet AGL and the cow horn syndrome will not reoccur :} John
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Not just bullets – cow horns with my Auster. Just a suggestion – fly more than 6 feet AGL and the cow horn syndrome will not reoccur :} Probably not the altitude, just not fast enough to outrun a cow. ;) cheers, Paul Saccani Perth West Australia
If you must know, it was tied down! And that was nearly forty years ago. JD
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just curious as to how good the fabric that covers aircraft is. are there any limitations etc, any plus or minus points
LIfe used to be a factor with linen fabrics especially if parked outside. Modern fabrics last longer (twenty years or more) if well cared for, which includes keeping them shielded from U/V light by ensuring the paintwork is maintained and hangaring when not in use. Repairs are easy to the fanric itself, also access to underlying structures is straightforward (just cut a hole and glue a patch on afterwards). Major risk is hailstorms which can wreck fabric pretty quickly but big ones can wreck metal skinned aircraft too, and the fabric ones are easier to repair. Fire is another consideration- most of the dopes are pretty flammable, so a fire in a fabric skinned aircraft can leave you with a charred skeleton very quickly and usually they don’t fly very well after that…. Some spectators are unaware that the Pitts Special is fabric covered, so the covering can manage a reasonably high speed and G-loading provided the stitching is close enough. Finally, the skills of fabric covering, repair and maintenance are not too hard to learn so you can help your LAME and your girlfriend won’t feel as out of place with a needle in her hand as she would with a rivet gun…. Coop
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I wonder how the Stealthed Auster is progressing? Dorothy would be completely invisible to RADAR, except that Coop carries his car keys in his pocket. G And the Swiss Army Knife in the other one….. Coop Both of which (keys and Swiss Army Knife) are two small to generate a return in L band, but those wonderful steel tubes every which way, would probably make wonderful dipoles. Which carbon RAM compound do you use in the paint ? I know not of this charred sheep’s pizzle to which you refer….. Then there’s the pressed steel ribs in the wings. On the other hand, some unkind souls have suggested that Dorothy’s return would be suppressed because she moves to slowly…. <sniff
It will depend on whether or not it is a doppler radar, and if so, how the range boxes have been set up, but I doubt she is slow enough.. Also there is the small matter of propulsion source. I haven’t seen a internal combustion engine yet that doesn’t have a pretty good radar signature.
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just curious as to how good the fabric that covers aircraft is. are there any limitations etc, any plus or minus points
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just curious as to how good the fabric that covers aircraft is. are there any limitations etc, any plus or minus points
I remember when I was learning to fly years ago there was a Decathlon that was damaged in a thunderstrom. The wings had to be completely recovered. Unfortunately the repair was not done correctly, and the doping and painting of the wings was inadequate leading to significant degradation in the sunlight after only 6 months. It was a major problem, but luckily was discovered before anything major happened.
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just curious as to how good the fabric that covers aircraft is. are there any limitations etc, any plus or minus points
The original natural fibres and cellulose dope tend to weather badly, although they will last for many years if hangared. Modern materials are much more durable. The advantage of fabric covering over metal skinning is that it is easier to repair and bumps that would dint metal may do no damage. On the other hand the skills and knowledge for handling it, while still available, are becoming uncommon. From a design point of view fabric covered aircraft can be just as effective as metal skinned ones, at least until speeds get above those associated with light aircraft, and have the advantage of no rivet heads or rough joins between sheets. And fabric covering is not subject to fatigue, although the underlying structure may be. JD
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On a historical note: Bullets pass straight through fabric but do nasty things to metal. I think this was one of the key differences between the Spitfire and Hurricane in WW2. Shot up Hurricanes were much easier to repair and get back running again. Cheers, Richard.
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On a historical note: Bullets pass straight through fabric but do nasty things to metal. I think this was one of the key differences between the Spitfire and Hurricane in WW2. Shot up Hurricanes were much easier to repair and get back running again. Cheers, Richard.
Not just bullets – cow horns with my Auster. JD
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Question:
LB has that same aversion to bare skin, and attraction to bedcaves. Usually she settles for a quick inspection of the cave, and then sleeping with her front half sticking out of the covers. Sammy doesn’t mind skin at all, and on cold nights she often sleeps under the covers at the foot of the bed. She usually enters the bed from the foot, too, so there’s no telling if she’ll end up under the sheet, or between the blanket and sheet. — Steve Touchstone, faithful servant of Sammy, Little Bit and Rocky (RB) Home Page: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/index.html Cat Pix: http://www.sirinet.net/~stouchst/animals.html
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Glad to see people still think I haven’t lost my writing ability
No, you definitely haven’t. I’ve only lost my mind, then
That comes with motherhood. <G Joy
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<snipped Great story, Vicky. Into the "Vicky Chapman Keepers" folder it goes! Sam
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Cats are curious creatures, in both senses of the word. For the 14 or so years that I’ve known Shmoggleberry, he’s had a phobia of bare skin against his fur. Well, not a *phobia* because obviously he likes a good scritching, and he has no problem with bare skin next to his fur if his fangs are being hypodermically inserted at the same time. But he simply won’t entertain the thought of settling himself down for a good purr session when in contact with even the merest hint of bare skin.
<SNIP That was wonderful, Yowie, and a very pleasent surprise after your post saying you wouldn’t be arround as much. I hope we’ll see more b*st*rd c*t storys, and maybe some b*st*rd b*by ones as well. — Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera) A house is not a home, without a cat.
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ROTFLMAO If that’s your swansong for the time being (until Cary Barekitten takes up somewhat less of it) it’s the size of a albatross! Many thanks Gordon, & the TT (who act in a not dissimilar fashion) — Feline family viewable at: http://community.webshots.com/user/exocat – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Cats are curious creatures, in both senses of the word. For the 14 or so years that I’ve known Shmoggleberry, he’s had a phobia of bare skin against his fur.
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Cats are curious creatures, in both senses of the word.
<reluctantly snipped for bandwidth ROFL! Great one, Yowie! Glad you couldn’t stay away. ;o) — Marina, Frank and Nikki marina (dot) kurten (at) pp (dot) inet (dot) fi Pics at http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/frankiennikki/ and http://community.webshots.com/user/frankiennikki
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Cats are curious creatures, in both senses of the word. <reluctantly snipped for bandwidth ROFL! Great one, Yowie! Glad you couldn’t stay away. ;o)
Oh, I can’t stay away *entirely*. Just the amount of time spent reading and posting has had to be reduced dramatically. That anecdote took 3 months to write! And I used to be able to churn out up to three a day. I just managed to finish it last night because Cary went to bed early and Joel was out so I had some precious time to myself. *bliss*. And what better way to spend it than to write Shmoggleberry stories? Glad to see people still think I haven’t lost my writing ability – I’ve only lost my mind, then Yowie — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Cats are curious creatures, in both senses of the word. For the 14 or so years that I’ve known Shmoggleberry, he’s had a phobia of bare skin against his fur. Well, not a *phobia* because obviously he likes a good scritching, and he has no problem with bare skin next to his fur if his fangs are being hypodermically inserted at the same time. But he simply won’t entertain the thought of settling himself down for a good purr session when in contact with even the merest hint of bare skin. This of course makes summer highly amusing, particularly when Shmogg goes through his "lap cat" phase. He’ll saunter down from the back of the lounge, give me the "present lap, mere human!" look, and climb upon my legs. He’s often kind enough to retract his claws too. Now, in winter, I’ve often got a blanket over my legs, and even if I don’t I’m wearing long pants (I don’t do skirts) so His Majesty has somewhere suitably non-skinlike to settle. But in summer, I usually wear shorts. Now Shmogg isn’t entirely stupid, but his little kitty brain isn’t wired like a human’s. In the same sort of cat logic that dictates that if the weather is bad out the back door, one ought to try the front door, Shmogg doesn’t just abandon the thought of sitting on my lap because there’s the dreaded Bare Skin where a nice cosy cat napping place ought to be. No, that would be human thinking. What he can feel is the fabric of my shorts. It may not be covering the whole of my legs, but its there, and its on my lap. Using his superior thought processes and amazing metamorphosing way, he tries to shrink himself from over 6kg of oafish cat into a slither of his former self – a sliver the right sort of shape and size to be able to sit on the sliver of shorts fabric that is on my lap.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! Stinky is just the same. He is a lap fungus three seasons of the year, when my legs are covered. He will *not* sit on my bare legs. I think he doesn’t want to slippy-slide off, and I suspect he is loath to stick his claws into my bare skin. He scrunches up onto my shorts, too. Theresa Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
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Ah, Yowie, I’ve always loved your talented writing and your tale here is just exceptional — loved it, loved it, loved it! Thank you! Christine (give that Shmoggleberry some scritches from me!)
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Cats are curious creatures, in both senses of the word. For the 14 or so years that I’ve known Shmoggleberry, he’s had a phobia of bare skin against his fur. Well, not a *phobia* because obviously he likes a good scritching, and he has no problem with bare skin next to his fur if his fangs are being hypodermically inserted at the same time. But he simply won’t entertain the thought of settling himself down for a good purr session when in contact with even the merest hint of bare skin. This of course makes summer highly amusing, particularly when Shmogg goes through his "lap cat" phase. He’ll saunter down from the back of the lounge, give me the "present lap, mere human!" look, and climb upon my legs. He’s often kind enough to retract his claws too. Now, in winter, I’ve often got a blanket over my legs, and even if I don’t I’m wearing long pants (I don’t do skirts) so His Majesty has somewhere suitably non-skinlike to settle. But in summer, I usually wear shorts. Now Shmogg isn’t entirely stupid, but his little kitty brain isn’t wired like a human’s. In the same sort of cat logic that dictates that if the weather is bad out the back door, one ought to try the front door, Shmogg doesn’t just abandon the thought of sitting on my lap because there’s the dreaded Bare Skin where a nice cosy cat napping place ought to be. No, that would be human thinking. What he can feel is the fabric of my shorts. It may not be covering the whole of my legs, but its there, and its on my lap. Using his superior thought processes and amazing metamorphosing way, he tries to shrink himself from over 6kg of oafish cat into a slither of his former self – a sliver the right sort of shape and size to be able to sit on the sliver of shorts fabric that is on my lap. Proof that cats do not obey the standard laws of physics is that he usually manages to actually do it. This may or may not have anything to do with the particularly malleability of my stomach (even more malleable now I’ve had Cary) but all 6kg of cat, including a quite generous udder, err, kibble storage device, manages to shift the bulk of itself into the 4th dimension, leaving only the smallest amount of himself actually in the same plane as my shorts. Sure, some fur may be tickling my bare (and allergic) legs, but thats because fur sticks out, but the bulk of him, despite all possible logic and reason, seems to manage to balance precariously on that small strip of fabric that make up the legs of my shorts. However, even his multi-dimensional phasing capabilities don’t always make up for his kitty brain. Because although cunning, shrewd, and quite capable of planning and executing the most intricate and incredibly subtle b*st*rd c*t tricks of ever increasing complexity, the Great Shmogg Brain cannot always over come his more basic at traits. Despite all reasoning, all logic, all incredibly well developed chutzpah, he cannot always quite overcome the fact, that he is, at the very core of his being, tucked away under layers of Cool and Suave, in that secret pocket of his heart, actually still a kittycat. The phrase "curious as a cat" wasn’t coined for nothing Long ago, I discovered I really didn’t enjoy having my sleepwear forming intricate knots in the small of my back in the dead of night. Nor did I like it balling up and poking me inthe kidneys, or it sneaking up my torso and trying to strangle me, or, the worst of all, trying to split me in two. Various forms of nightwear were tried and rejected, leaving me to conclude that the only suitable sleepwear, if needed at all, were bra and briefs. Therefore, under the covers, in the cover of darkness, there still lies…. bare skin. Shmogg is now a regular inhabitant of my bed. Its warm, comfortable, away from the baby when the baby is making noise, and with the human with the good scritching fingers when the baby is quiet. Shmogg jumps up onto the bed only a few moments after I’ve retired for the night, and I’m often rewarded for scratching the beast with sleep-inducing purrs. But sometimes, I make the mistake of having formed a cave with my blankets, and we all know about caves and cats. Even a stunningly smart cat who knows the wily ways of even the trickiest of humans cannot resist The Cave of Doom, whether that glorious cavern be made or ancient rock & stone, or be simply a coincidence formed out of a discarded grocery bag. No Great Gaping Grotto can go unexplored by any Fearless Fighting Feline, even if the cat may, in some other plane of existence, know that its a mere sheet, plastic bag, or other thoroughly mundane day to day object. If its shape makes a suitably concave area, space and time conspire against the cat, turning something that only topographers would find mildly interesting into a Den, a Lair, a catly Place of Power where lions (in the shapes of small domestic moggies) can enjoy the acoustics of their wild and unassuaged roar. (mew!) Shmogg is instantly attracted. All thoughts of settling down for a good scritching before retiring for the night go out the window, or more correctly, into the Tunnel of Mystery. With trepidation, he investigates the outer rim, making sure that the dreaded Cave Monster of Doom is not in residence (saying that the entrance is made of doona, has always been made of doona, and has been the same darn doona for the last 8 years is just a tad unfair). Once he is sure that his Dignity and other less important aspects of Cathood are not in mortal danger, he slinks in, wary and alert. Inside the cave it is warm and dark and soft and comfortable. Its a perfec t kitty hideout. Except of course for the deep dark secret that the mean old hoomin is keeping from overly curious kittycats. Thinking he has finally found the perfect lair, he curls up in the convenient cat-sized curve made from the angle of my legs and stomach when curled into the semi-fetal position. He closes his eyes, tucks the paws in and begins to purr like a cat who has finally found heaven on earth. This is the most perfect place, with his slave, all warm and dry, safe from the outside world, a mighty cave cat. The purrs are incredible, and although utterly soporific, I can’t fall asleep. I am waiting, you see, for the realisation to hit; I am waiting for the laws of Skin Phobia and Cave Irresistibility to clash. Don’t get me wrong, I love my dear old Shmogg under the covers, purring his little heart out. He may be a b*st*rd c*t, but he’s my b*st*rd c*t and we’ve been through alot together. That he still wants to curl up with me and bless me with his purrs says alot about our relationship I think, and I’ll put up with all his B*st*rd C*t tricks, the scratches, the guerrilla warfare on my ankles and the incredible stench of the litterbox for this simple pleasure, and I suspect he’s prepared to put up with generally being ignored for the screaming drooling one (Cary) and the smelly drooling one (Fluffy) just for the nightly chin scritch and my company whilst we both travel to the land of Nod. Its in these pleasant, purry times that we both know that Shtoopid Hoomin truly loves B*st*rd Cat and that despite all appearances to the contrary there is a soft spot in the heart of the B*st*rd C*t for his lowly slave. Still, nothing lasts forever and the balance inexorably shifts from Cave Irrisistability back to Skin Phobia. The purring ceases. The tension mounts. The purring, quietens, then halts altogether. In the silence, the space time continuum creaks under the strain as the equilibrium of Shmogg’s universe shifts. Suddenly, what was the perfect burrow for such a Supreme Being seems to be suspiciously similar to cheapish linen, and the wonderful central heating seems to be turning into something familiar…*far* too familiar. Perhaps he sniffs once to confirm, or perhaps his specialised kitty senses just *know*, but the Legendary Lion’s Lair switches back to a mere tunnel under the doona, and oh my, is that? Oh god, oh no! Its… Argggh! Its * Of course, snuggling contentedly against a nice, warm, comfortably small area of Bare Skin is not the same as skidding over acres and acres of the stuff. With one’s claws out. Without any regard * whatsoever * of the various organs and nerve endings that happen to be attached to said skin. Or, indeed, the quiet contented slumber of the shtoopid hoomin that happens to be quite fond of all that skin, nerve endings and various vital organs that are being trampled at high speed by a freaked out cat doing his impression of a bat out of hell. Or maybe that should be cat out of doona. Whilst he won’t go back under the doona that night once he’s calmed down, licked himself a few times, and smacked me about for laughing at him so much (after I’ve finished swearing at him, of course) what I entirely fail to understand is that Shmoggleberry, emeritus b*st*rd c*t, full of sneak and spite, capable of thinking up ever more bizarre and twisted ways to psychologically torture me, who can tell the time and who can train 3 hoomins and one d*g, a cat who is of world renown intellect and aptitude, can fall for the same damn trick every single night. Shtoopid cat. Yowie — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Response:
Cats are curious creatures, in both senses of the word. For the 14 or so years that I’ve known Shmoggleberry, he’s had a phobia of bare skin against his fur. Well, not a *phobia* because obviously he likes a good scritching, and he has no problem with bare skin next to his fur if his fangs are being hypodermically inserted at the same time. But he simply won’t entertain the thought of settling himself down for a good purr session when in contact with even the merest hint of bare skin. This of course makes summer highly amusing, particularly when Shmogg goes through his "lap cat" phase. He’ll saunter down from the back of the lounge, give me the "present lap, mere human!" look, and climb upon my legs. He’s often kind enough to retract his claws too. Now, in winter, I’ve often got a blanket over my legs, and even if I don’t I’m wearing long pants (I don’t do skirts) so His Majesty has somewhere suitably non-skinlike to settle. But in summer, I usually wear shorts. Now Shmogg isn’t entirely stupid, but his little kitty brain isn’t wired like a human’s. In the same sort of cat logic that dictates that if the weather is bad out the back door, one ought to try the front door, Shmogg doesn’t just abandon the thought of sitting on my lap because there’s the dreaded Bare Skin where a nice cosy cat napping place ought to be. No, that would be human thinking. What he can feel is the fabric of my shorts. It may not be covering the whole of my legs, but its there, and its on my lap. Using his superior thought processes and amazing metamorphosing way, he tries to shrink himself from over 6kg of oafish cat into a slither of his former self – a sliver the right sort of shape and size to be able to sit on the sliver of shorts fabric that is on my lap. Proof that cats do not obey the standard laws of physics is that he usually manages to actually do it. This may or may not have anything to do with the particularly malleability of my stomach (even more malleable now I’ve had Cary) but all 6kg of cat, including a quite generous udder, err, kibble storage device, manages to shift the bulk of itself into the 4th dimension, leaving only the smallest amount of himself actually in the same plane as my shorts. Sure, some fur may be tickling my bare (and allergic) legs, but thats because fur sticks out, but the bulk of him, despite all possible logic and reason, seems to manage to balance precariously on that small strip of fabric that make up the legs of my shorts. However, even his multi-dimensional phasing capabilities don
Question:
Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort?
Spinach seems to work wonders. Sheila Size 10 to 2 in 5 months (since 2001), thanks to Atkins! http://www.SugarFreeSheila.com – My Success Story, Extensive FAQ, & More!
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated…
Yes. Get going with the vegetables. 2-3 cups daily, munch on celery, what kinds of vegetables are available to you ? *
Response:
Wait a minute…does Atkins do this to everyone? If so, just one more mark against it in my book.
Mostly if they eat too much cheese and won’t eat their veggies. I’ve been lowcarbing for more than 7 years. I can count on one hand the number of times I got constipated on Atkins. — "There’s a seeker born every minute."
Response:
I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares.
Eat more fibrous vegetables. Flax seed is often called linseed in the UK (linum in Latin, if that helps). It’s the seed of the plant used to make linen fabric. You want to buy the flax meal or grind the seed yourself in a coffee grinder, rather than the oil, for fiber. After induction, try adding a handful of nuts. Not too many, as they do add carbs and high calories. Limit cheese, it tends to add to constipation. Drink plenty of water. — "There’s a seeker born every minute."
Response:
Try taking a tablespoon or two of olive oil in the morning, on an empty stomach. (It doesn’t taste bad.) Not only does it boost your metabolism, but it also gets things loosened. Jen
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145
I found that sprinkling a little bit of bran on things really helped. It didn’t take a lot, so any carbs I added by doing that were minimal. — Jean B.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. <snip Do you have Cod Liver Oil gel caplets there? That’s what I use occasionally, although I’m not (and never will be) on the Atkins diet. Good luck! Wait a minute…does Atkins do this to everyone? If so, just one more mark against it in my book.
nope. this guy didn’t eat enough veg. I do that sometimes too… tonight I shall gobble down tons of celery sticks…..
Response:
I added about 2 tablespoons of All bran extra fiber (1 carb per 2 tablespoons/ .01 oz) to my cereal in the morning and that caused a healthy BM. Keep the fresh leafy veggies in the diet- an make sure your drinking the water. Make sure your not overeating on the meats and cheese — Diane Atkins since 12/4/2003 234/203 /150 5"8 CCLL about 27 Enjoy life & keep the calories down to your weight x 10 and watch the salt! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145 I found that sprinkling a little bit of bran on things really helped. It didn’t take a lot, so any carbs I added by doing that were minimal. — Jean B.
Response:
See if you can find some wheat germ or wheat bran. That’ll do it too. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… Yes. Get going with the vegetables. 2-3 cups daily, munch on celery, what kinds of vegetables are available to you ? *
Response:
Jennifer, I’m not sure where you are…I’m in Poland. Hi. We’re relatively close, at least. We do have flaxmeal (called len) and bran by the bagful. I have a great bran muffin (well, considering it’s LC) recipe which helped me my first couple of weeks. We also have celery root, but recently have gotten celery…green stuff. Becky P.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145
Drink more water…. much more water. Find something with sugar alcohols.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. <snip They may call it linseed over there. What you want for fiber is the seed or meal not the oil. While the oil is very good for you it doesn’t contain fiber.
Thanks so much for the info…I’ll see if I can find it!
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. <snip
Do you have Cod Liver Oil gel caplets there? That’s what I use occasionally, although I’m not (and never will be) on the Atkins diet. Good luck! Wait a minute…does Atkins do this to everyone? If so, just one more mark against it in my book.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145 For really hard-to-shift stuff, Milk of Magnesia does the job, for the occasional nudge Senacot S and for daily maintenance, fibre, water and exercise. Can’t you get stuff sent from the west? We’re not talking exotic medecines here.
I could have it sent to me but it is complicated. It’s expensive to send something from the States and the mail is pretty unreliable here (even after EU entry). Stuff gets stolen all the time (even inexpensive items). I’d rather just work with what I can get here….
Response:
Walnuts, pecans, and almonds. — Eat less, exercise more. – MFW —
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145
Response:
JC, Is it the actual fiber count of the nuts, or something about their composition? I have a can of peanuts I almost tore into (after downing psyllium, tons of lettuce, you name it) but they didn’t have a high fiber count… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Walnuts, pecans, and almonds. — Eat less, exercise more. – MFW — Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145
Response:
It’s something about their composition, i.e.: fiber. Peanuts are not on the list. — Eat less, exercise more. – MFW —
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – JC, Is it the actual fiber count of the nuts, or something about their composition? I have a can of peanuts I almost tore into (after downing psyllium, tons of lettuce, you name it) but they didn’t have a high fiber count… Walnuts, pecans, and almonds. — Eat less, exercise more. – MFW — Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort?
There’s several things you can do to ease the problem: greatly increase your water intake so things will be less solid, increase your fat intake so things will be more lubricated, and increase your veggie intake for fiber so things will be looser. — As you accelerate your food, it takes exponentially more and more energy to increase its velocity, until you hit a limit at C. This energy has to come from somewhere; in this case, from the food’s nutritional value. Thus, the faster the food is, the worse it gets. – Mark Hughes, comprehending the taste of fast food
Response:
Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares.
<snip They may call it linseed over there. What you want for fiber is the seed or meal not the oil. While the oil is very good for you it doesn’t contain fiber. — Jeri "Change is inevitable, except from vending machines."
Response:
Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Ya’ll, I’m in my second week of induction with Atkins. While I’ve already lost a fair amount of weight (around 10 lbs), the constipation is killing me! While some of you may be ready to recommend flaxseed oil and unsweetened psyllium husks, let me explain my situation: 1. I’m currently living in a former Eastern bloc country where I don’t have access to many ingredients, and…. 2. I’ve gone to several health food stores here and asked for flax and psyllium and all I’ve gotten is blank stares. On the other hand, I have plenty of access to meat, cheese, sacharine, etc. Can anyone recommend a way to get myself going with vegetables or something of the sort? Any help would be greatly appreciated… 170/160/145
For really hard-to-shift stuff, Milk of Magnesia does the job, for the occasional nudge Senacot S and for daily maintenance, fibre, water and exercise. Can’t you get stuff sent from the west? We’re not talking exotic medecines here.
Response:
Question:
– Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 It has bugged me for years that the company that makes Razorback fiberglass covering material advertise that it is impervious to weathering.
Kinda hard on a guy’s faith in the reliability of products when there may be lots of companies who do not know the true characteristics of their product. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Fiberglass cloth is not impervious to weathering. I helped pull Razorback covering off of a TriPacer that sat outside for 15 years. One could grab a handful of the fabric and pull, it would tear and shred like old linen. The fabric had been originally finished as recommended by the manufacturer. Bruce A. Frank The suceptability to damage from moisture was something that surprised me. I had always been under the impression that the glass fiber was almost impervious to chemical damage. It is after all, glass. Aparently the small fibers are affected more than the glass in a jar. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
Response:
Roger, I haven’t done much fiberglass work myself…yet, but I have watched for hours the Vinyl ester/fiberglass creation of an amphibious hull over a foam form. The squeegees used were all plastic type used for automotive body filler work…thin an flexible to which the Vinyl ester would not stick once set up. Each layer of fiberglass was laid one at a time with 12 hour cure between layers. Each time after the next layer was squeegeed in place a sheet of polyester cloth (Ceconite) was squeegeed down onto the wet fiberglass layer, a peel ply. The next day when the polyester was peeled off the surface was ready, with no prep necessary for the next layer. There were almost no bubbles or voids visible in the finished sections. Where white spots were observed the builder, a stickler for detail, would drill a hole with a 3/64" drill bit into the bubble several layers down. He would then take a hypodermic syringe, insert it in the hole and fill from the bottom up…continuing to inject as the needle was withdrawn. I would say that the finished hull was 99.9 free of any visible defects. Bruce A. Frank – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? When you’re ready to paint (and you’ve hired the local sprayer for the Chebby dealer to breathe that poisonous vapor) ax him to hit the glass with a hair dryer, pop the bubbles, and fill/sand them smooth. Sit back and open a brewski. He can do it in the time you can earn the money to pay for it – doing something you’re good at. Sounds good, but unfortunately these (and very few of them) are in areas that won’t be on the outside. Some of them are four and 6 layers. and are for strength. Hence the concern over the few bubbles. I don’t have very many…maybe two or three up to a 1/4 inch across in close to two square feet. BTW this is with Vinyl Ester Resin if I didn’t say so before. They don’t show when building up the layers. Only as tiny white spots under the surface after cure. I’m wondering if I’m not using enough resin, or too much pressure squeeging the resin out. Well, I just finished two more layers… I used more resin with less catalyst, to give me a longer pot life & working time. I used the elcheapo, homemade squeege and although I think I may have this layup slightly on the wet side, it looks good. I say, slightly wet…there are no puddles, but there is absolutely no doubt that the surface is wet. Also this is the last layer in that layup BTW, I had more feel with the homemade squeege and it was more effective than the rubber one. Now the wait till morning to see what it looks like after cure. Roger — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Rich
Response:
Roger, In reading the various posts on this thread, I had three aditional thoughts. When building my boat, it was the low spots that often did me in b/c I was working an outside radius compound curve (on the outside lower edge of the hull). The inside radiai (sp?) of the hull layup were no prob. but I was running resin-rich in these areas. In boat hulls, water can seep through microscopic holes in the gell coat and fill voids in the layup. As the trapped moisture heats up, it vaporizes. The trapped vapor builds pressure and forms blisters in the layup, just as moisture can cause paint to blister off the side of a house. The blisters cause the delamination to spread through the layup, increasing the problem to the point of failure. Nasty. As for injecting resin, go to Home Cheap-O or a good paint store and locate the wallpaper section. In there you’ll usually find "wallpaper paste injectors". these are nothing more than B-D 50cc syringes with large-guage needles. They should do the trick, as they are intended to be used to kill bubbles and voids in wallpaper. They also work well for shooting grease into hard-to-reach areas. Sticking to spruce and cotton, Harry
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<snip Yes, and you have to be real careful that preparing the surface the second time does not damage the part by cutting too deep into the surface.
A good portion of the surface looked almost as if I had used peel ply, Too bad it all didn’t. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Those bubbles sometimes appear as if by magic and they come from a number of reasons. Getting the lay-up under tension, as you mention, is a prime source. After all we are taught to work the resin away from a center to the outside, but, if there is a low spot you end up pulling the cloth tight and it will lift away from the underlying substrate. These voids are *usually* visible as are the big bubbles of trapped air. I have found the use of peel-ply helps to reduce the problems with pulling the layup too tight. I have also found it makes it easier to work the air out.
When I redid the one 4 layer, layup I made it a lot richer than the previous batch (more resin for the cloth). Then squeeged the extra off the cloth where I can trim it off the original base. I came up with far fewer bubbles and dry spots, but I was wishing for a few yards of peel ply. I think that would have really helped. <SNIP The squeege doesn’t have to move fast. Moving it any faster than necessary will force some of the air you are trying to move, into and through the cloth. That leaves you with a ticking time bomb, just waiting for you to think it’s a great layup and go back in the house. Then all those little microscopic bubbles hold a convention and pop to the surface, or between layers. One key thing to remember is that once the epoxy is spread out the urgency is greatly reduced and the working time is increased some.
That was one thing I took into consideration. I also lowered the room temperature to about 60 when doing the layups. Between the lower temperature and the overhead fans, I think I about doubled the working time. Course, I did forget that pot life and working life are two distinct measurements. I reached for the brush and found it to be a permanent part of the resin cup. Sooo…I just scraped a bit of the excess on over to where I needed it. <:-)) Just DON’T TRY TO DO TOO MUCH AT ONE TIME. Keep the layups small so that you are not rushed.
Yah, but It looks like I could probably get one more layer on before the resin starts to set up…<:-)) Learned real quick on that. Thicker layups also tend to set up faster. Another thing with the squeege, keep just enough fresh resin on the surface ahead of it to lubricate its movement. You can use that to fill voids. Sometimes it becomes necessary to open a void with a small hole in the cloth (just spread a few fibers) and then work the resin, into that area. A small paint brush can also help by tapping in some extra resin.
Yah! the brushes I use are rather stiff/cheap and I use them to "stipple" (think that’s the term) the really stuborn ones… Maybe two more airplanes and I might be able to do one of these correctly. Use it instead of the squeege when dealing with inside layups. Also, always pre-wet the surface before applying the bid.
I prewet the first layer, then put the next layers on while the previous layer is in the early "Green" stage. I use a very sharp and wide wood chizzle to scrape/trim any high spots and remove any stray brush hair, or loose weave fibers from the previous layer. That leaves the surface ready for the next layer and tacky enough that I can position the layers and they stay put. When I smooth the cloth, it sticks. <:-)) The cloth I use with the low viscosity Vinyl Ester resin is a very dense weave. The thin resin saturates it nicely where Epoxy would never make it through the weaver. The cloth is so thick it feels like Velour. Heavy too. It took two of us to lift the roll of cloth up on the cutting bench. Between the Vinyl Ester Resin and the thick weaver cloth it makes a very strong structure. Ahhh…Bob, I thought you were going to fly the Cruiser to Oshkosh last year? Yeah, well the best laid plans often meet with unforseen obstacles. Working sixty plus hour weeks for several years significantly reduced building
time. Me? I retired. It doesn’t pay nearly as well either. <:-)) I had a chance to do some consulting for an outfit out of Toledo and I would have been doing exactly the same thing I did before retiring (for a lot more money). I think they have either 3 or 4 labs around the country. The pay was unbelieveable, but I retired so I didn’t have to work those kind of hours any more. Plus they wanted a three year contract. Financially, I should have taken it, but so far I’m happy and don’t miss the 12 to 16 hour days 7 days a week. With that job I’d have been hitting most of their labs each week and I could have afforded to purchase any kind of plane I wanted that I’m capable of flying…and a few I can’t <G It’s just there a lot more to life than "just" money. I had over a year where my health prevented any progress. Finally, I
decided Sorry to hear about the health problem. long ago that this had to be a pay as you go project and if I can’t afford to buy the parts needed, it will just have to wait until I can. I also have been less than willing to compromise on the quality of the parts and componets. When it is finally finished, it will also be paid for. If that means I have to wait five more years to finish, so be it.
So far, every thing is paid for. I think I may be able to make it up through the panel, (or at least part way) but when it comes engine and prop time, the Deb will have to go. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bob Reed www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site) KIS Cruiser in progress…Slow but steady progress…. "Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice, pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!" (M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)
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So, the guy was being more than just a stickler for detail. He was trying to make certain his hull lasted a good long time. <:-))
I meant that he would go after voids that were hardly bigger than the drill bit. Certainly it was a good process for larger voids. I also thought that vinyl ester layups were MUCH more resistant to water damage than epoxy layups. Bruce A. Frank
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And it’s a whole lot less work to get them right the first time.
You can say that again. Removing a lay-up that is several layers thick can be a real bear. I have first hand experience, but I doubt if Bob has ever run into that?
Wrong! I have had to pull off two different cured layups and neither was easy. I have been pretty lucky with not having too many cases of air pockets. I have had more problems with them using Aeropoxy than I had with the Hexell 24/27. With a heat gun and care you can remove a four ply lay-up, but you not only have that work of removing the lay-up (and it is work), but there is extra work in preparing the surface for re-lamination.
Yes, and you have to be real careful that preparing the surface the second time does not damage the part by cutting too deep into the surface. Those bubbles sometimes appear as if by magic and they come from a number of reasons. Getting the lay-up under tension, as you mention, is a prime source. After all we are taught to work the resin away from a center to the outside, but, if there is a low spot you end up pulling the cloth tight and it will lift away from the underlying substrate. These voids are *usually* visible as are the big bubbles of trapped air.
I have found the use of peel-ply helps to reduce the problems with pulling the layup too tight. I have also found it makes it easier to work the air out. <SNIP The squeege doesn’t have to move fast. Moving it any faster than necessary will force some of the air you are trying to move, into and through the cloth. That leaves you with a ticking time bomb, just waiting for you to think it’s a great layup and go back in the house. Then all those little microscopic bubbles hold a convention and pop to the surface, or between layers.
One key thing to remember is that once the epoxy is spread out the urgency is greatly reduced and the working time is increased some. Just DON’T TRY TO DO TOO MUCH AT ONE TIME. Keep the layups small so that you are not rushed. Another thing with the squeege, keep just enough fresh resin on the surface ahead of it to lubricate its movement. You can use that to fill voids. Sometimes it becomes necessary to open a void with a small hole in the cloth (just spread a few fibers) and then work the resin, into that area.
A small paint brush can also help by tapping in some extra resin. Use it instead of the squeege when dealing with inside layups. Also, always pre-wet the surface before applying the bid. Ahhh…Bob, I thought you were going to fly the Cruiser to Oshkosh last year?
Yeah, well the best laid plans often meet with unforseen obstacles. Working sixty plus hour weeks for several years significantly reduced building time. I had over a year where my health prevented any progress. Finally, I decided long ago that this had to be a pay as you go project and if I can’t afford to buy the parts needed, it will just have to wait until I can. I also have been less than willing to compromise on the quality of the parts and componets. When it is finally finished, it will also be paid for. If that means I have to wait five more years to finish, so be it. Bob Reed www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site) KIS Cruiser in progress…Slow but steady progress…. "Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice, pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!" (M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)
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It has bugged me for years that the company that makes Razorback fiberglass covering material advertise that it is impervious to weathering. Fiberglass cloth is not impervious to weathering. I helped pull Razorback covering off of a TriPacer that sat outside for 15 years. One could grab a handful of the fabric and pull, it would tear and shred like old linen. The fabric had been originally finished as recommended by the manufacturer. Bruce A. Frank – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The suceptability to damage from moisture was something that surprised me. I had always been under the impression that the glass fiber was almost impervious to chemical damage. It is after all, glass. Aparently the small fibers are affected more than the glass in a jar. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
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<snip You can use a syringe to fill some bubbles but you must also remember that the bond will still be much weaker than it should be. If the area you are dealing with is not structural in nature, use of the syringe to fill is fine. Structural bonds should be redone if there is any significant occurrence of bubbles.
And it’s a whole lot less work to get them right the first time. Removing a lay-up that is several layers thick can be a real bear. I have first hand experience, but I doubt if Bob has ever run into that? With a heat gun and care you can remove a four ply lay-up, but you not only have that work of removing the lay-up (and it is work), but there is extra work in preparing the surface for re-lamination. Those bubbles sometimes appear as if by magic and they come from a number of reasons. Getting the lay-up under tension, as you mention, is a prime source. After all we are taught to work the resin away from a center to the outside, but, if there is a low spot you end up pulling the cloth tight and it will lift away from the underlying substrate. These voids are *usually* visible as are the big bubbles of trapped air. Speaking of trapped air…You always end up with air in the resin when you mix it…The idea is to "minimize" the amount of air introduced when mixing and it is normal to let it set and "de-air" for a few minutes. I’ve been thinking of building a "de-air" chamber to use with the vacuum cleaner. However, you don’t even need the trapped air in the resin to have it show up later. If you get a bit energetic squeeging the lay-up, instead of letting it soak up naturally at first, you can create and force microscopic air bubbles under the lay-up. These are the ones that seem to come from no where. Sometimes they show up an hour or two after doing the lay-up. A good rule is, if the excess resin being squeeged off, has a lot of air in it to the point of looking milky, or foamy, it’s time to slow down and let things set for a few minutes. That is a sign there is a lot of air trapped in the resin and it "will" come out! Probably not until its too late to do much about it. The squeege doesn’t have to move fast. Moving it any faster than necessary will force some of the air you are trying to move, into and through the cloth. That leaves you with a ticking time bomb, just waiting for you to think it’s a great layup and go back in the house. Then all those little microscopic bubbles hold a convention and pop to the surface, or between layers. Another thing with the squeege, keep just enough fresh resin on the surface ahead of it to lubricate its movement. You can use that to fill voids. Sometimes it becomes necessary to open a void with a small hole in the cloth (just spread a few fibers) and then work the resin, into that area. And one more little unlikely area:….Due to the way the cloth is cut, some fibers will come loose around the edge. The squeege, or brush can pick them up and transfer them to some place out on the lay-up. They are darned hard to see and will form a high spot for the next layup if you don’t give the surface a good going over. You’d think you’d catch all these, but when the next layer goes on as soon as the first is squeeged out, or right after it sets they can be very easy to miss and will almost guarantee an air bubble. I’ve also seen some white spots form on the surface. These have to be dry spots and must have been caused by air escaping. I don’t know for sure. As I’ve said before. I’m a beginner at this, and am sorta writing down my observations and ramblings mixed with all the helpful (and appreciated ) suggestions as I go.. Thoughts and corrections (socially acceptable please <G) are greatly appreciated. After all, this thing may. (will) be pulling 4 to 6 Gs, if I’m not too old to fly it by the time I get it finished and it’ll be my butt hanging out. Ahhh…Bob, I thought you were going to fly the Cruiser to Oshkosh last year? BTW, my site http://www.rogerhalstead.com/glasair2.htm (page two) is updated. Pictures will follow shortly. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bob Reed www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site) KIS Cruiser in progress…Slow but steady progress…. "Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice, pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!" (M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)
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writes: Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? … This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. … Keep in mind that I know nothing about glass construction. Could you take a syringe and either draw out the air or after it cures fill it in? I know this would kill a lot of syringes. Dion — My 1946 Stinson 108 is for sale. Contact me if you’re interested.
If you can catch the formation of air pockets at the right time, yes you can draw out the air or otherwise release it and obtain a good bond. The problem is that often the cause of the air pocket is the air caught under the glass but caused by the glass being pulled too tight and thus pulling away from the surface being bonded to. You can use a syringe to fill some bubbles but you must also remember that the bond will still be much weaker than it should be. If the area you are dealing with is not structural in nature, use of the syringe to fill is fine. Structural bonds should be redone if there is any significant occurance of bubbles. Bob Reed www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site) KIS Cruiser in progress…Slow but steady progress…. "Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice, pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!" (M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)
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Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? … This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. … Keep in mind that I know nothing about glass construction. Could you take a syringe and either draw out the air or after it cures fill it in? I know this would kill a lot of syringes.
There are quite a number on here that know far more about this subject than I, but from my standpoint and limited knowledge: This is one of those, wellll…, yah, kinda, sorta, almost… For appearance sake, you can drill out and fill. Actually it also prevents moisture problems/damage. In some cases you might be able to fill a void. There the problem is that the void is not completely empty and is more like a whole bunch of little voids together which makes it very difficult to fill the whole thing. Then even when you get the resin in, the spot still remains white. Now, If you spot the bubbles/voids/dry spots *before* the resin starts to set up, you could use a small syringe to draw out the air. I have a little sharp pointed tool to help spread the fibers so I can work the air out of these spots and work additional resin in.. The problem here is spotting them. Some are quite visible and these are *usually* relatively easy to work out. Some just show up as a *little* bump in the cloth and they are difficult, but not impossible to find. Then there are those that show no difference in coloration from the wet cloth and leave no bump. These show up as little whit spots, but not until the layup has cured. You can try to fill them, but I’ve had no success at doing so. The other alternative is to drill out that spot "if it’s small" and then fill the small hole with resin. The resin is strong, but not as strong as the fiberglass so that will leave a small weak point. Then it depends on the location. Most of these layups are way larger than absolutely necessary which builds in a great margine for safety and strength. However, any dry glass fiber is a source for future problems as the glass is sensitive to damage from moisture. Once moisture gets in the samage can spread, but much depends on the naure of the void and cloth. One possibility is to get the old heat gun out, and heat the affected spot to the point of softening the resin. This is relatively easy if the resin is new. With a 12 to 24 hour cure which is more than enough for almost all voids and dry spots to show, you can heat the area to the point where the whole layup can be lifted. (far easier after 12 hours than 24). Possibly heating a local spot to that point would allow using a needle to fill voids that otherwise could not be fixed, or just allow reworking that specific area. I’ve never tried this, but as I’m going to make up several laminates on the bench, I’ll expirment a bit. Too bad I can’t get resin through the needles we use on our old diabetic tom cat. They are just too fine to use for injecting resin, but they would be ideal for extracting air and suficient numbers certainly isn’t a problem. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Dion — My 1946 Stinson 108 is for sale. Contact me if you’re interested.
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Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass
laminate? … This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or
5. … Keep in mind that I know nothing about glass construction. Could you take a syringe and either draw out the air or after it cures fill it in? I know this would kill a lot of syringes. Dion — My 1946 Stinson 108 is for sale. Contact me if you’re interested.
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Actually, from what you described, maybe just covering the top layer with a plastic cover (or peal ply?) might do. Sounds like you are just pulling bubbles from working the layup.
The last two layups went real fine. I say layups, but one was 6 layers thick, while the other was much larger, but only two. No bubbles so far. And…Yes, the darn things are easy to create just working the layup. Speed and pressure of the squeege makes a tremendous difference as does the amount of resin present both on the surface and within the layup. I’ve done this around egdes that want to pop up. A heavy plastic is best because it WILL bond some. Light stuff rips up when you try to remove it.
A little mold release on the plastic (not silicon though) might do the trick. I need to make up a sheet which will be done on the work bench so I think I’ll try some of these ideas. Oh! One thing I did today was turn on the overhead fans and take the temperature down to about 60, instead of the normal 70 in there. That made a tremendous difference in pot and working life. Without the pressure of the stuff setting up in short order, I didn’t have to hurry as much and could be much more careful (read less frantic) about finishing the layup. I have two more layups ready to do. When they are finished, the temperature will be taken back up to 70 and left there over night with fans running. BTW, as the shop heater is one of those gas fired IR hanger heaters, it is shut down during all layups and the structure actually gets warm and warm I don’t need with a fast setting resin <:-)) IF all goes well, it’ll be time to mate the fuselage halves tomorrow or Sunday. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just a thought. Try some practice layers first! Best luck. Only way I know of is to vacuum bag your parts. Yah know…. I have actually been toying with that idea for the large layups. Not sure just how, or where, I’d draw the air out. Thing is, it doesn’t take much of a vacuum to get the bubbles out. Then when you let the air back in, it forces the resin to fill the voids. It doesn’t actually have to be bagged, but the area has to be enclosed and evacuated. Bagging is normally the easiest way. What the heck. I own a grinder…just-in-case. The area is temperature controlled. Needs better ventilation though. I think I breathed a few to many fumes tonight. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please) — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
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Roger, I had the same problem a few years ago with a boat I was building, except I was using polyester resin (big mistake). After two seasons of use, the tiny white spots grew to be about the size of quarters two layers down. When I cut them out with the Drimel, I found that they were both dry and delaminated. I’d try one of those ribbed rollers first and see if that helps. I’ve seen bass boat builders use them for wet layups and they appear to work quite well. Good luck, Harry
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I’d try one of those ribbed rollers first and see if that helps. I’ve seen bass boat builders use them for wet layups and they appear to work quite well. Good luck, Harry
I’m not a plane builder, but I do have some experience with fiberglass and bubbles. I used to work at a fiberglass yacht building facility (Hatteras Yachts) and did quite a bit of wet layups there. Our procedure was to make up a disposable tray out of chipboard and pour activated resin into this tray about 1/2" deep. We would take the cloth mat and squish it into the resin until there was no bubbles and the cloth was completely saturated. We would pull it out of the resin, pull off the stringy bits, kind of squeegy off the excess resin with our gloves and then place it onto the prepared surface. We always used a metal ribbed roller for the roll out. Make sure that you store the roller in a can of cleaner or it will be ruined. It seemed to me that the better saturated the cloth, the easier the rollout and the less chance for bubbles. I guess if you think about it, bubbles are just a lack of resin. Something else: we had to take the used cardboard trays outside for disposal because the heat generated when the resin kicked off had been known to catch fire. Forgive me if this is totally off base for plane building, but I thought I would try to help. Sometimes a different perspective can be good. Good luck, -Trent PP-ASEL
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Actually, from what you described, maybe just covering the top layer with a plastic cover (or peal ply?) might do. Sounds like you are just pulling bubbles from working the layup. I’ve done this around egdes that want to pop up. A heavy plastic is best because it WILL bond some. Light stuff rips up when you try to remove it. Just a thought. Try some practice layers first! Best luck. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Only way I know of is to vacuum bag your parts. Yah know…. I have actually been toying with that idea for the large layups. Not sure just how, or where, I’d draw the air out. Thing is, it doesn’t take much of a vacuum to get the bubbles out. Then when you let the air back in, it forces the resin to fill the voids. It doesn’t actually have to be bagged, but the area has to be enclosed and evacuated. Bagging is normally the easiest way. What the heck. I own a grinder…just-in-case. The area is temperature controlled. Needs better ventilation though. I think I breathed a few to many fumes tonight. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please) — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
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Roger, I haven’t done much fiberglass work myself…yet, but I have watched for
When it comes to fiberglass and airplanes I am a complete beginner hours the Vinyl ester/fiberglass creation of an amphibious hull over a foam form. The squeegees used were all plastic type used for automotive body filler work…thin an flexible to which the Vinyl ester would not stick once set up. Each layer of fiberglass was laid one at a time with 12 hour cure between layers.
Depends on the thickness of the ply, the temperature, and the size…I lay up as many as 6 layers at one time, but those are only 7 inches in diameter (back wing attach point.) Those went without a hitch and I was able to trim them while the resin was still in a green state and that sure beats having to grind off the excess. <:-)) The much larger reinforcements for the horizontal stabilizer are only good for two at a time. If the resin is still in the green state, but solid, you can put another layer right on top. If it’s going to go to full cure, then the peel ply is the way to go… As far as prep sanding, you hit the surface once over lightly. If the sand paper gums up, you don’t have to sand. Just clean the area thouroughly with acetone and put on another layer. I’ve done a fair amount of glass and Epoxy work, but this is my first project using Vinyl Ester resin which has a very low viscosity compared to the Epoxy mixture. That lets me use a very thick weave in the cloth. It feels almost like Velour. (sp?). This is also my first flying project although owning an old airplane is a project in and of itself. It’s just not quite the same as building one. ?Each time after the next layer was squeegeed in place a sheet of polyester cloth (Ceconite) was squeegeed down onto the wet fiberglass layer, a peel ply. The next day when the polyester was peeled off the surface was ready, with no prep necessary for the next layer. There were almost no bubbles or voids visible in the finished sections.
I’ve gotten down to the point where I see very few white spots and the major layups don’t have any bubbles now. Where white spots were observed the builder, a stickler for detail, would drill a hole with a 3/64" drill bit into the bubble several layers down. He would then take a hypodermic syringe, insert it in the hole and fill from the bottom up…continuing to inject as the needle was withdrawn. I would say that the finished hull was 99.9 free of any visible defects.
The problem with bubbles is that the glass is attacked by water and if he didn’t fill the voids they would tend to grow. Where the glass is in contact with the water 24 hours a day the damage can become wide spread in a relatively short time compared to the life of the hull. The same is true for airplanes. You shouldn’t leave any voids for the water to get in, but the damage from small voids would most likely spread far, far slower than in the boat hull. Still, if the water can get to unprotected/bare fiberglass it can cause problems as the glass fiber is easily damaged by moisture. Voids are not a good sign. Tiny ones are almost impossible to avoid according to the manual, but with practice and good technique you should be able to keep them to a minimum. So, the guy was being more than just a stickler for detail. He was trying to make certain his hull lasted a good long time. <:-)) The suceptability to damage from moisture was something that surprised me. I had always been under the impression that the glass fiber was almost impervious to chemical damage. It is after all, glass. Aparently the small fibers are affected more than the glass in a jar. . — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bruce A. Frank — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? When you’re ready to paint (and you’ve hired the local sprayer for the Chebby dealer to breathe that poisonous vapor) ax him to hit the glass with a hair dryer, pop the bubbles, and fill/sand them smooth. Sit back and open a brewski. He can do it in the time you can earn the money to pay for it – doing something you’re good at. Sounds good, but unfortunately these (and very few of them) are in areas that won’t be on the outside. Some of them are four and 6 layers. and are for strength. Hence the concern over the few bubbles. I don’t have very many…maybe two or three up to a 1/4 inch across in close to two square feet. BTW this is with Vinyl Ester Resin if I didn’t say so before. They don’t show when building up the layers. Only as tiny white spots under the surface after cure. I’m wondering if I’m not using enough resin, or too much pressure squeeging the resin out. Well, I just finished two more layers… I used more resin with less catalyst, to give me a longer pot life & working time. I used the elcheapo, homemade squeege and although I think I may have this layup slightly on the wet side, it looks good. I say, slightly wet…there are no puddles, but there is absolutely no doubt that the surface is wet. Also this is the last layer in that layup BTW, I had more feel with the homemade squeege and it was more effective than the rubber one. Now the wait till morning to see what it looks like after cure. Roger — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Rich
Response:
Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please) — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
Response:
Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate?
When you’re ready to paint (and you’ve hired the local sprayer for the Chebby dealer to breathe that poisonous vapor) ax him to hit the glass with a hair dryer, pop the bubbles, and fill/sand them smooth. Sit back and open a brewski. He can do it in the time you can earn the money to pay for it – doing something you’re good at. Rich
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please)
A two-inch brush is kinda’ large unless you’re working on something like a firewall. Quarter inch bubbles are way too big to leave. It’s not a big problem on non-structural parts, but it does show that your technique needs polishing. And you shouldn’t be chasing bubbles so much. Start in the center, and work outwards when you can. Use a squeegee wherever possible. Cut some small ones out of larger ones (the soft ones are best), and make some custom ones with rounded corners etc. If the cloth is properly saturated, then only very small bubbles should be left behind unless you’re pulling on the cloth or somehow else causing the cloth to pull away. Sounds like you just need a little more practice. It takes a light touch, and some feel for how wet the cloth should be. It should be sort of "wrung out", but still have a slight sheen after it’s worked, and shouldn’t require endless stipling. You might pay a visit to someone who’s good at laminating, and watch them work. After you get the hang of it (it won’t take long), you’ll wonder how it ever could have seemed difficult. Wayne www.ctaz.com/~wmbjk
Response:
– Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? When you’re ready to paint (and you’ve hired the local sprayer for the Chebby dealer to breathe that poisonous vapor) ax him to hit the glass with a hair dryer, pop the bubbles, and fill/sand them smooth. Sit back and open a brewski. He can do it in the time you can earn the money to pay for it – doing something you’re good at.
Sounds good, but unfortunately these (and very few of them) are in areas that won’t be on the outside. Some of them are four and 6 layers. and are for strength. Hence the concern over the few bubbles. I don’t have very many…maybe two or three up to a 1/4 inch across in close to two square feet. BTW this is with Vinyl Ester Resin if I didn’t say so before. They don’t show when building up the layers. Only as tiny white spots under the surface after cure. I’m wondering if I’m not using enough resin, or too much pressure squeeging the resin out. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Rich
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please)
you may be expecting too much from the process,,,,,,,,,, also, try a roller rather than a brush, the roller will level the resin much better, and a brush may be used to remove resin froma ‘too wet’ layup, and thus lead to residual bubbles as the material bridges also, heavy cloth will bridge as you have noted, might try a lighter weight of cloth, some small bubbles may bever cause a problem, gelcoat offers a superior surface and bubble free for finnishing purposes, the layer next to the gelcoat needs to be near perfect to support the brittle gelcoat, plus, large air pockets will actually pop in hot sinlight, breaking the surface, ruining the part,,,,, experience will also help with making judgements since all of the above are variables,,,, — Mark Smith Tri-State Kite Sales http://www.trikite.com 1121 N Locust St 1-812-838-6351
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please) A two-inch brush is kinda’ large unless you’re working on something like a firewall.
It’s about a two fot square area with 4 laminations. Quarter inch bubbles are way too big to leave. It’s not a big
They only show up in one layer and most are about 1/8th inch although I did have one that was near a 1/4 inch…at least they are only about a 1/32 thick. problem on non-structural parts, but it does show that your technique needs polishing.
Virtually every thing in this plane is structural. I won’t argue that at all. I’ve done a lot of Epoxy work, but the viscosity was probably more than 10X the viscosity of the Vinyl Ester Resin. And you shouldn’t be chasing bubbles so much. Start in the center, and work outwards when you can. Use a squeegee wherever possible.
I do. I start applying the resin in the center and working it out toward the edges with the brush. A friend suggested I quit using the heavier rubber squeege supplied and cut one out of a butter dish top and leave one corner sharp for poking bubbles. Cut some small ones out of larger ones (the soft ones are best), and make some custom ones with rounded corners etc. If the cloth is properly saturated, then only very small bubbles should be left behind unless you’re pulling on the cloth or somehow else causing the cloth to pull away.
No, I learned right quick not to try and use my gloves to press on bubbles, or touch the layup…Instant tent! and start all over. Sounds like you just need a little more practice. It takes a light touch, and some feel for how wet the cloth should be. It should be sort of "wrung out", but still have a slight sheen after it’s worked, and shouldn’t require endless stipling. You might pay a visit to someone who’s good at laminating, and watch them work. After you get the hang of it (it won’t take long), you’ll wonder how it ever could have seemed difficult.
I have a couple coming over, but like me they worked with Epoxy instead of the lighter resin. I have to admit that each time the layups look better, but I don’t want to have to grind any off. that’s work and it’s dirty<:-)) I originally thought I had too much resin, but I’m thinking it’s just the opposit. The confusing part is that the layups look really good when I finish. They look good an hour later. 12 hours later they show a few, (only a few) internal and external white spots, which to me, means dry. Thanks, — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wayne www.ctaz.com/~wmbjk
Response:
Only way I know of is to vacuum bag your parts. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please) — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? When you’re ready to paint (and you’ve hired the local sprayer for the Chebby dealer to breathe that poisonous vapor) ax him to hit the glass with a hair dryer, pop the bubbles, and fill/sand them smooth. Sit back and open a brewski. He can do it in the time you can earn the money to pay for it – doing something you’re good at. Sounds good, but unfortunately these (and very few of them) are in areas that won’t be on the outside. Some of them are four and 6 layers. and are for strength. Hence the concern over the few bubbles. I don’t have very many…maybe two or three up to a 1/4 inch across in close to two square feet. BTW this is with Vinyl Ester Resin if I didn’t say so before. They don’t show when building up the layers. Only as tiny white spots under the surface after cure. I’m wondering if I’m not using enough resin, or too much pressure squeeging the resin out.
Well, I just finished two more layers… I used more resin with less catalyst, to give me a longer pot life & working time. I used the elcheapo, homemade squeege and although I think I may have this layup slightly on the wet side, it looks good. I say, slightly wet…there are no puddles, but there is absolutely no doubt that the surface is wet. Also this is the last layer in that layup BTW, I had more feel with the homemade squeege and it was more effective than the rubber one. Now the wait till morning to see what it looks like after cure. Roger – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 Rich
Response:
Only way I know of is to vacuum bag your parts.
Yah know…. I have actually been toying with that idea for the large layups. Not sure just how, or where, I’d draw the air out. Thing is, it doesn’t take much of a vacuum to get the bubbles out. Then when you let the air back in, it forces the resin to fill the voids. It doesn’t actually have to be bagged, but the area has to be enclosed and evacuated. Bagging is normally the easiest way. What the heck. I own a grinder…just-in-case. The area is temperature controlled. Needs better ventilation though. I think I breathed a few to many fumes tonight. — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2 – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Any one know how to get ALL the air bubble out of a glass laminate? Not the one using epoxy, but the lower viscosity Vinyl Ester Resin? I can get almost all of them out. The last ones are like chasing bugs…Smart little critters. I use a 2" paint brush with a bit of resin and keep poking behind them which eventually chases them out. When I finished up last night it looked like I had them all. This morning with the resin fully cured I could easily see 4 or 5. They aren’t big…maybe a 1/4 inch or even less, but they sure do show up. OR am I being too demanding trying to get every one out? Any thoughts? (Socially acceptable please) — Roger (K8RI EN73) WWW.RogerHalstead.com N833R, World’s Oldest Debonair? S#CD-2
Response:
Question:
David; I don’t think that’s a stupid question at all, it tells me that you are prepared learn and keep an open mind. Building an airplane is not rocket science, I think perseverance, dogged determination, a reasonable place to work, a very supportive significant other (if applicable) and some appropriate working capitol, are vital things you will need to see it to completion. Every airplane is built up of many small parts, each one of which you will build and eventually assemble into the major assemblies of the finished aircraft. You have some pretty good advice from other responses. When it comes right down to it, it doesn’t matter where you start, pick a part that appeals to you and get at it! When you’re finished that one go on to another and keep going until all your parts are assembled at the local airport. There are a lot of excellent books available for you to learn what you need to know, there are lots of seminars put on by kit manufacturers, and thousands of successful builders (through this NG and others) who would be too happy to share their experiences with you. If you haven’t already decided which aircraft to build, you may already be facing the toughest part of the building process. I would recommend a membership in the EAA as a really good place to start. Good luck!! Al Beasley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m probably asking a stupid question, but I’m just wondering how do you start building an aircraft? Like do you start with the wheels then move up, or the base of the airframe, what? I’m just having trouble try to figure out where you would start. Also what sort of courses at uni or TAFE(non-uni technical school) would be useful for a potential aircraft builder? Thanks, David
Response:
David, I started with the tail of my Wright 1902 glider replica because a) it looked the simplest b) it was one of the cheapest parts to build. Thirty-four hours and $70 later, I had four sticks, some fabric, and a spool of waxed linen cord. I still haven’t finished it, but I’ll get to it one of these days. I’ll start building ribs soon because mine are single-piece, steam-bent white ash and the steam generator kinda makes the shop really hot. Then (maybe) I can sew the wing skins durring the winter months, and complete the airframe next spring. I don’t know what kind of project you’re working on, but my recomendation is to start with the small parts first. Stuff that’s easy to store and won’t consume large ammounts of shop space. That way, you won’t have to worry about where to put the fusalage (nope, can’t spell) when you’re ripping those sheets of plywood. Just some thoughts, Harry
Response:
I started with the tail of my Wright 1902 glider replica because a) it looked the simplest b) it was one of the cheapest parts to build. Thirty-four hours and $70 later, I had four sticks, some fabric, and a spool of waxed linen cord. I still haven’t finished it, but I’ll get to it one of these days. I’ll start building ribs soon because mine are single-piece, steam-bent white ash and the steam generator kinda makes the shop really hot. Then (maybe) I can sew the wing skins durring the winter months, and complete the airframe next spring. I don’t know what kind of project you’re working on, but my recomendation is to start with the small parts first. Stuff that’s easy to store and won’t consume large ammounts of shop space. That way, you won’t have to worry about where to put the fusalage (nope, can’t spell) when you’re ripping those sheets of plywood.
I’m not on any project yet, but it was just something I was interested in finding out. First stage of my project will be to get my pilots liscense. At the moment I’m only a simulator pilot. When I do build I’d like to go for something along the higher preformance jet models. Thanks for all the replies! David
Response:
If it helps, I’ve been documenting my new parasol on my web site. I haven’t updated the site in a while – mostly because I’m to the point of finishing up a dozen things that were already started or sketched in temporarily. Lot’s of work going into it, but little that actually shows. The wings are going on now. When that’s done it just needs covering. (91% done, only 80% remaining!) — Richard Lamb Texas Parasol web page: http://www.flash.net/~lamb01
Response:
I’m probably asking a stupid question, but I’m just wondering how do you start building an aircraft? Like do you start with the wheels then move up, or the base of the airframe, what? I’m just having trouble try to figure out where you would start. Also what sort of courses at uni or TAFE(non-uni technical school) would be useful for a potential aircraft builder? Thanks, David
Response:
I’m probably asking a stupid question, but I’m just wondering how do you start building an aircraft? Like do you start with the wheels then move up, or the base of the airframe, what? I’m just having trouble try to figure out where you would start.
Depends on the design, and whether you are building from a kit or from scratch. Most plans I have seen begin with the fuselage and tail, then wings after the fuse is on the main wheels. Also what sort of courses at uni or TAFE(non-uni technical school) would be useful for a potential aircraft builder? Thanks,
Metalshop, woodshop, paintshop, electronics… but remember, you said for "builder". For "designer" you want loads of engineering courses.
Response:
I’m probably asking a stupid question, but I’m just wondering how do you start building an aircraft? Like do you start with the wheels then move up, or the base of the airframe, what? I’m just having trouble try to figure out where you would start. Also what sort of courses at uni or TAFE(non-uni technical school) would be useful for a potential aircraft builder? Thanks, David
The wings are often the most complicated and time consuming to build so the designer of the Christavia suggested you do them first. Because if you got them done and still had the enthusiasm for building, you’d probably finish the project. Also, once the wings are done, you can hang them up out of the way. If you build the fuselage first, you are going to need a LOT of room in your shop to build the wings while the fuselage is sitting there taking up room. Corky Scott
Response:
If it helps, I’ve been documenting my new parasol on my web site. I haven’t updated the site in a while – mostly because I’m to the point of finishing up a dozen things that were already started or sketched in temporarily. Lot’s of work going into it, but little that — Richard Lamb Texas Parasol web page: http://www.flash.net/~lamb01
Response:
Question:
I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof.
I’ve heard that putting things in the deep freeze for a day or so is another way of killing dust mites, though you would need to wash as well to remove traces of their faeces. Thanks, Ann
– Five Cats
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. I’ve heard that putting things in the deep freeze for a day or so is another way of killing dust mites, though you would need to wash as well to remove traces of their faeces. Thanks, Ann
I also have dust mite allergies. I have found mattress covers, pillow covers and blankets that are washable at allergycontrol.com. If it gets cold I can always use a second blanket, dh likes that since he is always hot and i am always cold. My problem is the dust ruffle…I know it should be washed in hot water as often as the bedding, but is is a real pain to get on and off the bed. How often should the dust ruffle be washed?? As often as the bedding??? We have looked for bedspreds that we like, but no luck so far. thanks, sue
Response:
Put the dust ruffle on with velcro. Then it will zip on and off. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. I’ve heard that putting things in the deep freeze for a day or so is another way of killing dust mites, though you would need to wash as well to remove traces of their faeces. Thanks, Ann I also have dust mite allergies. I have found mattress covers, pillow covers and blankets that are washable at allergycontrol.com. If it gets cold I can always use a second blanket, dh likes that since he is always hot and i am always cold. My problem is the dust ruffle…I know it should be washed in hot water as often as the bedding, but is is a real pain to get on and off the bed. How often should the dust ruffle be washed?? As often as the bedding??? We have looked for bedspreds that we like, but no luck so far. thanks, sue
grandma Rosalie
Response:
Check Out The Comfort Cool Dustmite Proof Duvet Covers. They come in Blue, Rose, Bone and White. Signature To Chat With A LIVE Sales Person { NOW ! } Click On The Box To The Right Add the HumanClick "Click to Chat" button to your own e-mails for free at www.humanclick.com
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann
Response:
I posed this question to one of the American Lung association reps & a local medical center at a small workshop. They said that some people believed that, but that it didn’t really hold true. Freezing didn’t kill the mites. I had thought that for a long time before this, but I guess it may not be so. Lou Ann – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. I’ve heard that putting things in the deep freeze for a day or so is another way of killing dust mites, though you would need to wash as well to remove traces of their faeces. Thanks, Ann — Five Cats
Response:
Allergists office told me to wash the sheets/pillow cases weekly, and all other fabric in the bedroom i.e. curtains, blankets etc 3 times a year. Ria
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. I’ve heard that putting things in the deep freeze for a day or so is another way of killing dust mites, though you would need to wash as well to remove traces of their faeces. Thanks, Ann I also have dust mite allergies. I have found mattress covers, pillow covers and blankets that are washable at allergycontrol.com. If it gets cold I can always use a second blanket, dh likes that since he is always hot and i am always cold. My problem is the dust ruffle…I know it should be washed in hot water as often as the bedding, but is is a real pain to get on and off the bed. How often should the dust ruffle be washed?? As often as the bedding??? We have looked for bedspreds that we like, but no luck so far. thanks, sue
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann Duvets often have covers which can be washed — dont know if that is enough — but in your situation I would get an allergy free comforter if possible or if not just use a regular comforter and then cover with a washable cover OR how about using washable blankets instead of a duvet — you could wash and bleach the blankets when you did the sheets. If the washable blankets aren’t warm enough in winter she could wear a blanket sleeper [I think they still make them big enough for 9 year olds -- but if not, a sweat suit makes a wrm set of pajamas]
Yes, they do. Land’s End makes wonderful Polartrec pajamas with and without feet for this age (my son has some). $$$, but they have some stretch and last forever. Banty
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There are products on the market to help deal with dust mites and laundry. Be careful with the ones which are based on tannin — they will probably stain the fabric. Two non-tannin types are: De-mite, from the Allerpet people, is a laundry additive which claims to eliminate dust mites. It contains, "Nonionic & Anionic Surfactants; Benzyl Benzoate; Tea Tree Oil; Methyl Salicylate." Aller-Rx Concentrated Laundry Detergent, is a fairly new product which contains, "Non-ionic surfactants, proprietary natural anti-allergen extracts, and deionized water." Claims to neutralize dust mites, among other things. Both products claim to eliminate the need for hot-water wash. No idea how effective either is; haven’t used ‘em myself. Garth Allen Ottawa, Ontario. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is a laundry detergent that supposedly kills dust mites. I believe it is made by ALL…..but not too sure. Maybe that would help some. Denise Indianapolis I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann
Response:
There is a laundry detergent that supposedly kills dust mites. I believe it is made by ALL…..but not too sure. Maybe that would help some.
I looked at a bottle of this last week. After carefully reading the label, I concluded that it does not do anything any other detergent will do. Since this hype annoyed me – I bought a competing brand. "The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has limits." Einstein
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I made a quilt for the beds of my oldest two by covering a cotton mattress pad with cotton material. I turned the pad upside down and used the quilting lines of the pad to sew it to the material. (Actually I used printed material – one had lions and tigers on it and the other had deer. First I outlined the figures with the machine and then quilted the whole thing using the quilting lines). I then attached a ruffle or skirt of the same material, but you might not want to do that. The mattress pad was white and of course could be washed in hot water. Just get a material to cover it with that will also be washable in hot water.
Great idea. I’d add – pre-wash both the material and pad in hot water and dry them however you plan to dry the finished piece, then sew the cover. Banty
Response:
I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann
Response:
says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann
Gee, blankets and cotton bedspreads still exist, don’t they? Banty
Response:
I made a quilt for the beds of my oldest two by covering a cotton mattress pad with cotton material. I turned the pad upside down and used the quilting lines of the pad to sew it to the material. (Actually I used printed material – one had lions and tigers on it and the other had deer. First I outlined the figures with the machine and then quilted the whole thing using the quilting lines). I then attached a ruffle or skirt of the same material, but you might not want to do that. The mattress pad was white and of course could be washed in hot water. Just get a material to cover it with that will also be washable in hot water. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann
grandma Rosalie
Response:
There is a laundry detergent that supposedly kills dust mites. I believe it is made by ALL…..but not too sure. Maybe that would help some. Denise Indianapolis
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a 9 yo child who is allergic to dust. We have done our best to make her room as allergy free as possible – wood floors, blinds for the windows. We machine wash her bed linen in a hot cycle about once a week. Now here’s where we’re having the problem – the comforter. According to the care instructions, these need to be washed in a cold, gentle cycle which doesn’t kill the dust mites. I saw some of the "allergy free" comforters which cost more than I can afford. Even if I could, my daughter hated them because they were all white and had too much of a "hospital" look to them. I also found a few duvets but these all had "gentle" cycle. I’m looking for suggestions for bed covering that will make a room colorful and homey but still be allergan proof. Thanks, Ann
Duvets often have covers which can be washed — dont know if that is enough — but in your situation I would get an allergy free comforter if possible or if not just use a regular comforter and then cover with a washable cover OR how about using washable blankets instead of a duvet — you could wash and bleach the blankets when you did the sheets. If the washable blankets aren’t warm enough in winter she could wear a blanket sleeper [I think they still make them big enough for 9 year olds -- but if not, a sweat suit makes a wrm set of pajamas]
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Question:
I was at an RV repair shop in Yuma a few weeks ago. They partially removed the awning and sewed it up – by hand – for about a 6" tear. They then used a liquid paste or sealer over the newly sewed area. Sorry I didn’t pay more attention to it but I was busy with my own coach. As I recall, the shop was on East 38th St, exit 4, about 3 miles east of downtown. Good luck!
Response:
You can repair the tear by hand using a curved carpet needle and a herringbone stitch. Back when aircraft were made of fabric, tears were all done that way, followed by a length of linen tape as a cover patch, cut with a zig-zag edge made with pinking shears. Frederick
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I was at an RV repair shop in Yuma a few weeks ago. They partially removed the awning and sewed it up – by hand – for about a 6" tear. They then used a liquid paste or sealer over the newly sewed area. Sorry I didn’t pay more attention to it but I was busy with my own coach. As I recall, the shop was on East 38th St, exit 4, about 3 miles east of downtown. Good luck!
Response:
Hi I have a small tear in my awning about 3 inches long almost to where it meets with the RV, Is there reliable repair or do I bite the big one and replace the whole thing?
Carefree makes a patch kit that is basically just a sheet of self adhesive clear vinyl- but.. depending on where the tear is (if there is significant stress on the area), this might or might not do a good job. A lot of times I will use dental floss to sew the area, then VLP (Vinyl Liquid Patch- available at most hardware stores), or Plastiseam (ditto) to aid in the repair. If the rest of the fabric is in good condition, this will usually get a couple more years out of it, if the rest is marginal, I would go ahead and replace. — Chris Bryant Bryant RV Services- http://www.bryantrv.com On RVing-RV TV about RVs, by RVers: http://www.onrving.com On RVing Forums- http://www.onrving.com/forums/default.asp
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Hi I have a small tear in my awning about 3 inches long almost to where it meets with the RV, Is there reliable repair or do I bite the big one and replace the whole thing? Barbara
Response:
Hi I have a small tear in my awning about 3 inches long almost to where it meets with the RV, Is there reliable repair or do I bite the big one and replace the whole thing? Barbara
Hey, Barb, have you never heard of duct tape?
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Question:
Hi there.. here is another newbie question for ya all.. I have been doing some tshirt work and they are coming along well. The problem I have is when I finish one I take a sheet of teflon and iron it really well but is this enough? Should I be using some kind of sealer? If so what exactly are you supposed to use? The paint I use is liquitex BASICS mixed with airbrush medium and this seems to be the least expensive solution that is perm on fabric. Any help/advice would be great! Thanks people!
Response:
Hi there KB: Well I’ve been doing T shirts for years now. The teflon I hear is very good as long as your iron is on the hottest setting possible, don’t let it sit in one spot KEEP it moveing. I for one use Wax paper with pain brown paper over it and iron this. It sets the paint up good. When washed the colours blend in even more.. Hope this helps ya Lightnen
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Hi there KB: Well I’ve been doing T shirts for years now. The teflon I hear is very good as long as your iron is on the hottest setting possible, don’t let it sit in one spot KEEP it moveing. I for one use Wax paper with pain brown paper over it and iron this. It sets the paint up good. When washed the colours blend in even more.. Hope this helps ya Lightnen
Hey thanks for the replys.. If I understand correct does the wax go into the shirt when it heats up? This sounds like a cool idea and I have some wax paper to give it a try. Any others use this method? KB
Response:
Well the wax might be left behind but what little wax is not very evident and besides it would come out in the wash. I still use this method. As for the bondall I came across an article in a paint news I’ve given it a try a few times and on Black shits I don’t like it for the paint does not penetrate the fabric enough I’d say for my pic washed out or most of it and I had my presser set high at 70lbs so it wasn’t as if I wasn’t blowing hard enough.. Hope ya have good luck and Happy Brushing.. Lightnen
Response:
I think you’re essentially doing it the right way. I use Createx for shirts with a little of their bonding medium mixed into the paint. Setting the paint with an iron is important. Be sure to iron it long enough to heat the paint up a little bit. I’ve never used a teflon sheet- a long time ago, I picked up an end roll of newspaper from the local paper’s press- they switch rolls before they run out, so the paper doesn’t have any printing on it, and there was about 3 or 4 feet left on the spool. It works great as a buffer between the iron and shirt, and it was free. Stanger
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Try an old linen pillow case – take a couple clothespins and clip it to the top of your board and drape it over the work – you can use the hottest setting for your iron but, be sure to keep the iron moving at all times… This also works as a good preliminary method for getting a good flat surface to start with – a way to knock down the ‘fuzzies’ that like to snag the over-spray. Depending on the paints you use, you spray a light coat of your airbrush medium or extender on as a pre-coat, then iron it with your pillow case as described. Makes a nice smooth surface to work on. Jw – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi there.. here is another newbie question for ya all.. I have been doing some tshirt work and they are coming along well. The problem I have is when I finish one I take a sheet of teflon and iron it really well but is this enough? Should I be using some kind of sealer? If so what exactly are you supposed to use? The paint I use is liquitex BASICS mixed with airbrush medium and this seems to be the least expensive solution that is perm on fabric.
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Question:
James Mather had some very interesting things to say about "Febreze, help pls": If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats.
I’ve used it safely around Felix, but it’s quite possible that some cats might be allergic to some ingredient in it. — Seanette Blaylock [make obvious address correction to e-mail] "Either you’re being sarcastic, or your post leaked over to me from a parallel universe, or one or both of us is insane and/or stupid and/or not paying attention and/or lying." Ben, ATSR
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See this website for more information: http://www.febreze.com/pet_rumor.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats. We have 4 cats and one may be having an allergic reaction. Needless to say we have stopped using it immediately. He is Toby. About 5 years old neutered long haired white domestic cat. The other 3 cats are speyed females. He has no problems normally and they all get on extremely well. Over the last 2 days he has taken to hiding in the linen cupboard with his mouth slightly open. He sometimes growls, but not at anything in particular. When opicked up he doesnt seem in any pain and we can see nothing in his mouth. Is this the kind of experinec which other cat owners have had. Thanks for your help James
Response:
Have a look in the deja news archive (www.deja.com) and you’ll find lots of messages about it. Do a power search on specific newsgroups. I think it’s quite possible he’s reacting to it. Febreze wouldn’t necessarily affect all animals the same way. Some may react while others don’t. I’d never trust a controversial product like this around my pets. No matter how many people swear up and down it’s safe, somewhere down the road it’s gonna come out that it was extremely toxic … give it time. Same goes for products like Frontline, Advantage, Program and the like. Hope your cat recovers soon.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats. We have 4 cats and one may be having an allergic reaction. Needless to say we have stopped using it immediately. He is Toby. About 5 years old neutered long haired white domestic cat. The other 3 cats are speyed females. He has no problems normally and they all get on extremely well. Over the last 2 days he has taken to hiding in the linen cupboard with his mouth slightly open. He sometimes growls, but not at anything in particular. When opicked up he doesnt seem in any pain and we can see nothing in his mouth. Is this the kind of experinec which other cat owners have had. Thanks for your help James
Response:
James Mather had some very interesting things to say about "Febreze, help pls": If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats.
I’ve used it safely around Felix, but it’s quite possible that some cats might be allergic to some ingredient in it. — Seanette Blaylock [make obvious address correction to e-mail] "Either you’re being sarcastic, or your post leaked over to me from a parallel universe, or one or both of us is insane and/or stupid and/or not paying attention and/or lying." Ben, ATSR
Response:
See this website for more information: http://www.febreze.com/pet_rumor.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats. We have 4 cats and one may be having an allergic reaction. Needless to say we have stopped using it immediately. He is Toby. About 5 years old neutered long haired white domestic cat. The other 3 cats are speyed females. He has no problems normally and they all get on extremely well. Over the last 2 days he has taken to hiding in the linen cupboard with his mouth slightly open. He sometimes growls, but not at anything in particular. When opicked up he doesnt seem in any pain and we can see nothing in his mouth. Is this the kind of experinec which other cat owners have had. Thanks for your help James
Response:
Have a look in the deja news archive (www.deja.com) and you’ll find lots of messages about it. Do a power search on specific newsgroups. I think it’s quite possible he’s reacting to it. Febreze wouldn’t necessarily affect all animals the same way. Some may react while others don’t. I’d never trust a controversial product like this around my pets. No matter how many people swear up and down it’s safe, somewhere down the road it’s gonna come out that it was extremely toxic … give it time. Same goes for products like Frontline, Advantage, Program and the like. Hope your cat recovers soon.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats. We have 4 cats and one may be having an allergic reaction. Needless to say we have stopped using it immediately. He is Toby. About 5 years old neutered long haired white domestic cat. The other 3 cats are speyed females. He has no problems normally and they all get on extremely well. Over the last 2 days he has taken to hiding in the linen cupboard with his mouth slightly open. He sometimes growls, but not at anything in particular. When opicked up he doesnt seem in any pain and we can see nothing in his mouth. Is this the kind of experinec which other cat owners have had. Thanks for your help James
Response:
James Mather had some very interesting things to say about "Febreze, help pls": If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats.
I’ve used it safely around Felix, but it’s quite possible that some cats might be allergic to some ingredient in it. — Seanette Blaylock [make obvious address correction to e-mail] "Either you’re being sarcastic, or your post leaked over to me from a parallel universe, or one or both of us is insane and/or stupid and/or not paying attention and/or lying." Ben, ATSR
Response:
See this website for more information: http://www.febreze.com/pet_rumor.html – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats. We have 4 cats and one may be having an allergic reaction. Needless to say we have stopped using it immediately. He is Toby. About 5 years old neutered long haired white domestic cat. The other 3 cats are speyed females. He has no problems normally and they all get on extremely well. Over the last 2 days he has taken to hiding in the linen cupboard with his mouth slightly open. He sometimes growls, but not at anything in particular. When opicked up he doesnt seem in any pain and we can see nothing in his mouth. Is this the kind of experinec which other cat owners have had. Thanks for your help James
Response:
Have a look in the deja news archive (www.deja.com) and you’ll find lots of messages about it. Do a power search on specific newsgroups. I think it’s quite possible he’s reacting to it. Febreze wouldn’t necessarily affect all animals the same way. Some may react while others don’t. I’d never trust a controversial product like this around my pets. No matter how many people swear up and down it’s safe, somewhere down the road it’s gonna come out that it was extremely toxic … give it time. Same goes for products like Frontline, Advantage, Program and the like. Hope your cat recovers soon.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If this question has already been covered and exhausted I apologise. I remember some items about the fabric deoderiser, Febreze, not being good for cats. We have 4 cats and one may be having an allergic reaction. Needless to say we have stopped using it immediately. He is Toby. About 5 years old neutered long haired white domestic cat. The other 3 cats are speyed females. He has no problems normally and they all get on extremely well. Over the last 2 days he has taken to hiding in the linen cupboard with his mouth slightly open. He sometimes growls, but not at anything in particular. When opicked up he doesnt seem in any pain and we can see nothing in his mouth. Is this the kind of experinec which other cat owners have had. Thanks for your help James
Response:
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